So, so, so hard for me to say anything about this. KISS changed my life when I was 5. That said, I know exactly who/what they are. I don't defend them. I don't know why anyone would. The only thing I would probably disagree with is Mitch's "below average singing." In the 70s Paul Stanley was right up there with Robert Plant and Rob Halford. But if you're looking at KISS's singing OVERALL.....ok, probably average at best.
Gotta disagree with all of you on this one. Bagging on KISS is easy, from the higher perch of 2023; where so very much water and great songs have gone under the bridge since 1977.
But listen.
If you throw 4 hard rock/heavy metal musicians into a room with their gear, no matter how complex and savage their own music projects are; after a few beers one of them's gonna play a KISS riff. Like "Black Diamond", or "Strutter", or "Mr. Speed". At least one more guy will pick up on it, and all will find their way into it. And they'll be having a massive amount of fun playing it.
That says something about them right there, that KISS was a formative musical influence far beyond most more "acceptable" and perfectly great bands of that era or since can ever claim. And that leaves all the other stuff, makeup, Pyro, controversy, capitalism, all of it outside that door.
The riffs have outlived, and will outlive, all else said or written about KISS.
I'm not a musician, so I can't comment on the "four musicians in a room will eventually play KISS" theory. (I am a writer, though. So I can comment on the "a hundred monkeys in a room full of typewriters will eventually write the complete works of Shakespeare" theory. And that comment is: Yes!) However, I would guess that none of those musicians are aspiring to play KISS music. They just picked something fun and familiar that would give them some common ground to groove on before moving on to something more interesting/original. Like a beginning guitar student who plays "Smoke on the Water" for the first time. It's exciting that you're actually playing a real rock song, but that's not where you want to stay forever. That said, I'm not denying KISS their place in music history. They earned it.
'Probably the worst band with the most good songs.' A bit like The Grateful Dead maybe, ha ha. Remember when The Replacements covered Black Diamond? I wondered if I'd missed something and listened to an old cassette of whatever album it's on for the first time since I was 10. Yikes, they were so awful. Still, slow dancing to Beth with Mari Wilensky at the Grade 6 dance is a treasured memory. 1977 is a great year for albums but, at the time, I think I was discovering Black Sabbath which means that I would have still been processing Technical Ecstasy. Still am...
I actually started listening to The Replacements because of their cover of "Black Diamond". Somehow I avoided them in college even though everyone was into them at the time. But when I heard that cover years later, I went back and rediscovered them.
Your introduction to Black Sabbath was "Technical Ecstasy"? Yikes. I'm surprised you stuck with them.
Hard album to love. I took my son to see Black Sabbath on their farewell tour when it came through Melbourne in 2013(?). I was very surprised to hear 'Dirty Women' live. The Replacements really found something on Black Diamond. At the time, I was coming to terms with my GenX identity and felt affirmed by it somehow. It was like, 'okay we didn't see The Beatles on Ed Sullivan but dammit we had stuff too!'
No way! I took my son to the Sabbath farewell tour as well. It was supposed to be his first concert, but we ended up seeing Rush while we were waiting for Sabs to get their act together. I wrote about it if you're interested. I suppose if they had to play something from Technical Ecstasy it might as well be Dirty Women. https://goodmenproject.com/featured-content/sabbath-bloody-sabbath-lbkr/
Great write up! Pretty much our experience. Funny crowd. It was the stoner kids at school all grown up. I thought the setlist was brilliant. Sometimes these old bands come and run through a series of songs that leave you thinking, 'I'm a big fan. Who was that for?' but BS got it right. The big songs plus all the others you want to hear - Children of the Grave was very cool. Nothing from Never Say Die mind you...
I think labeling them as "probably the worst band with the most good songs" is the fairest assessment as I won't deny their early records are a lot of fun, even if they are dumb with creep-o lyrics. My dad is a huge fan and they had a bit of a comeback in my high school days when The Donnas covered "Strutter" for that dumb KISS movie. Even saw them about a decade ago with pops and maybe it's just spending quality time with the old man that made it fun, but it was a night of good laughs at the stupidity of it all.
I would love to go to a rock concert with my dad. A few years ago, he and my mom went to see a triple bill of Styx, Foreigner and Don Felder. Except when my dad told me about it, he called Don Felder Ben Feldman. I really should've insisted on going with them. I would've had enough material for a dozen essays. Also, I love The Donnas cover of "Strutter".
It’s hard to hear Kiss objectively now without effort. When I was a kid they hooked me, and parents weren’t sure what this band was which made it more attractive, of course. Now I don’t seek them out, but will listen to Detroit Rock City if it comes on.
There are a few songs that crop up from time to time that surprise me. C'mon and Love Me", "I Stole Your Love" and "She" among them. Nothing wrong with that.
So, so, so hard for me to say anything about this. KISS changed my life when I was 5. That said, I know exactly who/what they are. I don't defend them. I don't know why anyone would. The only thing I would probably disagree with is Mitch's "below average singing." In the 70s Paul Stanley was right up there with Robert Plant and Rob Halford. But if you're looking at KISS's singing OVERALL.....ok, probably average at best.
Gotta disagree with all of you on this one. Bagging on KISS is easy, from the higher perch of 2023; where so very much water and great songs have gone under the bridge since 1977.
But listen.
If you throw 4 hard rock/heavy metal musicians into a room with their gear, no matter how complex and savage their own music projects are; after a few beers one of them's gonna play a KISS riff. Like "Black Diamond", or "Strutter", or "Mr. Speed". At least one more guy will pick up on it, and all will find their way into it. And they'll be having a massive amount of fun playing it.
That says something about them right there, that KISS was a formative musical influence far beyond most more "acceptable" and perfectly great bands of that era or since can ever claim. And that leaves all the other stuff, makeup, Pyro, controversy, capitalism, all of it outside that door.
The riffs have outlived, and will outlive, all else said or written about KISS.
I'm not a musician, so I can't comment on the "four musicians in a room will eventually play KISS" theory. (I am a writer, though. So I can comment on the "a hundred monkeys in a room full of typewriters will eventually write the complete works of Shakespeare" theory. And that comment is: Yes!) However, I would guess that none of those musicians are aspiring to play KISS music. They just picked something fun and familiar that would give them some common ground to groove on before moving on to something more interesting/original. Like a beginning guitar student who plays "Smoke on the Water" for the first time. It's exciting that you're actually playing a real rock song, but that's not where you want to stay forever. That said, I'm not denying KISS their place in music history. They earned it.
'Probably the worst band with the most good songs.' A bit like The Grateful Dead maybe, ha ha. Remember when The Replacements covered Black Diamond? I wondered if I'd missed something and listened to an old cassette of whatever album it's on for the first time since I was 10. Yikes, they were so awful. Still, slow dancing to Beth with Mari Wilensky at the Grade 6 dance is a treasured memory. 1977 is a great year for albums but, at the time, I think I was discovering Black Sabbath which means that I would have still been processing Technical Ecstasy. Still am...
I'd put Jerry Garcia & Robert Hunter's early '70s catalog up against any other legendary songwriter, including Bob Dylan & Sir Gene Simmons.
I actually started listening to The Replacements because of their cover of "Black Diamond". Somehow I avoided them in college even though everyone was into them at the time. But when I heard that cover years later, I went back and rediscovered them.
Your introduction to Black Sabbath was "Technical Ecstasy"? Yikes. I'm surprised you stuck with them.
Hard album to love. I took my son to see Black Sabbath on their farewell tour when it came through Melbourne in 2013(?). I was very surprised to hear 'Dirty Women' live. The Replacements really found something on Black Diamond. At the time, I was coming to terms with my GenX identity and felt affirmed by it somehow. It was like, 'okay we didn't see The Beatles on Ed Sullivan but dammit we had stuff too!'
No way! I took my son to the Sabbath farewell tour as well. It was supposed to be his first concert, but we ended up seeing Rush while we were waiting for Sabs to get their act together. I wrote about it if you're interested. I suppose if they had to play something from Technical Ecstasy it might as well be Dirty Women. https://goodmenproject.com/featured-content/sabbath-bloody-sabbath-lbkr/
Great write up! Pretty much our experience. Funny crowd. It was the stoner kids at school all grown up. I thought the setlist was brilliant. Sometimes these old bands come and run through a series of songs that leave you thinking, 'I'm a big fan. Who was that for?' but BS got it right. The big songs plus all the others you want to hear - Children of the Grave was very cool. Nothing from Never Say Die mind you...
How are all three of you right?
I think labeling them as "probably the worst band with the most good songs" is the fairest assessment as I won't deny their early records are a lot of fun, even if they are dumb with creep-o lyrics. My dad is a huge fan and they had a bit of a comeback in my high school days when The Donnas covered "Strutter" for that dumb KISS movie. Even saw them about a decade ago with pops and maybe it's just spending quality time with the old man that made it fun, but it was a night of good laughs at the stupidity of it all.
I would love to go to a rock concert with my dad. A few years ago, he and my mom went to see a triple bill of Styx, Foreigner and Don Felder. Except when my dad told me about it, he called Don Felder Ben Feldman. I really should've insisted on going with them. I would've had enough material for a dozen essays. Also, I love The Donnas cover of "Strutter".
The Mighty Mighty Bosstones cover of “Detroit Rock City” for the same project is fantastic.
It’s hard to hear Kiss objectively now without effort. When I was a kid they hooked me, and parents weren’t sure what this band was which made it more attractive, of course. Now I don’t seek them out, but will listen to Detroit Rock City if it comes on.
There are a few songs that crop up from time to time that surprise me. C'mon and Love Me", "I Stole Your Love" and "She" among them. Nothing wrong with that.
Agreed all on Kiss comments. For me, 1977 was all about Bat Out Of Hell- Meatloaf.