Somehow your snobbery got through my spam blocker today. I was about to delete it when I noticed the the album being pitched. Since this is one of the most classic albums I read on. For the record, Clapton apologized profusely for his drug-laden racists attacks back in 2018 and is hardly canceled. (What an absurd comment.) Gordon did kill his mother, but was found to be mentally disabled and is spending prison time in a Medical prison in CA. I guess you elitist bastards never made a mistake in your lives. I have no idea where you got the information on the late-great Skydog's guitar being over-dubbed. You guys remind me of 3 east-coast snobs sitting around your flat drinking red wine spouting useless drivel trying to one-up each other. By the way, how are your Biden votes working out for you?
Hi Alan! I hope you're having a great summer. To address your points in order:
1) Drugs and alcohol don't make you racist, but they might make you forget to hide your racism in a crowd;
2) Mental illness doesn't excuse murder, but it should prevent people from getting a gun;
3) I thought I made a mistake once but I was wrong;
4) It is well known that Layla is full of overdubs and it is not a criticism of Allman's playing at all. I just prefer a live, full band jam over studio construction when possible. Europe 72 suffers from the same issue;
5) The only red wine I drink is Manischewitz. Miller Lite all the way baby!
6) Obviously Brandon is a senile old man who can barely put together a sentence. Do you really think I would support some corporate centrist? This is Elizabeth Warren country up here, baby! But even a senile centrist is still better than a conman trying to bullshit his way into a coup.
We're so glad you're back and that you love Layla too. It's one of my top 10 albums. What are your favorite tracks?
And again your effete snobbery comes through. Spiro Agnew got it right when describing some "journalists" as being part of "an effete corps of impudent snobs." Your writing proves him correct, especially when considering our current crop of pseudo-journalists across the board, bought off or intimidated by the deep state (read See-eye-A) who won't question our government or anyone carries the water for them. Journalists nowadays are either too scared or too dumb to confront them on issues like the murders of JFK, RFK, MLK, Jr, JFK, Jr, et al, Apollo hoax, 9/11, endless hegemonic war & last but not least, the persecution of President Trump...nuff said. Oh yes, forgot the biggest one of all, the 70 year coverup of a mountain of information, evidence, files on UFOs, aliens, lies told by NASA, & back ops projects which have sucked up probably $$20 TRILLION tax dollars since 1946 or so.
Ah yes, a classic comeback from one who believes all the narratives dished out by the government who is slowly but surely edging us closer and closer to an Orwellian nightmare, a.k.a., 1984. Just because you can't see what's in front of your proverbial nose doesn't mean you haven't been hoodwinked. Remember what Mark Twain was purported to have said, "it's easier to fool some people than it is to convince them they've been fooled."
Jul 27, 2022Liked by Mitch Blum, CJ Kaplan, Ken Warshaw
so, Michael Jackson's Thriller is out because he was a weirdo and (probable) horrible person; but this overrated, medicore "blues" is in despite Clapton being a documented and horrible person?
Yup, absolutely blame me. I knew this was going to come back on me when I denied Michael Jackson several months back. And here we are. By way of explanation, I'm going to make the following distinction (and you're free to disagree with that as well):
Eric Clapton did and said terrible things, recognized and acknowledged that he did and said those things and made a conscious effort to atone for them. You can say he did so for PR/career-saving purposes and that is certainly a valid argument. But at least he did something.
MJ, on the other hand, did terrible things to vulnerable human beings, refused to admit that he did those things, was enabled to continue doing those things (by people who were arguably just as horrible as he was) and never made any effort to atone for those things. Would he have made amends had he lived longer? Hard to say.
And not that you asked, but I'll continue my distinction with Roger Waters. Roger does not believe he is an anti-semite. He believes he is simply anti-Israel for its policies against the Palestinians. Based on the things he's said and the company he keeps, I don't agree. But I also recognize that there are many people who do.
I don't think you could get even a handful of people to stand up and say there was nothing wrong with what MJ was doing. And by a handful I mean nobody.
Exactly what is it that Roger Waters has said or what has the "ones with whom he hangs" said that constitutes anti-Semitism? Seems that all one has to do to fall in that category is to criticize Israel.
We’re not here to explain the various manifestations of antisemitism. You seem more than capable enough, and definitely passionate enough to go do some research on your own.
It’s Hanukkah…the three of us have some candles to light and some peace to be enjoyed.
Roger Waters clearly hates Jews but you have every right to defend and support him. Specifically:
1) he’s a vocal supporter of the BDS movement, which promotes self-determination for Palestinians, but does not accord the same privilege to Israelis.
2) he propagates harmful stereotypes against Jews at his shows by projecting the Star of David on a pig during “Money”, reinforcing the old canard that Jews control the final financial markets.
3) he conflates Israel and worldwide Jewry, and blames all Jews for the policies of the Israeli state.
The world is full of repressive terrorist states, but Roger Waters’ focus is always on Israel - an imperfect country, but a progressive and democratic country. Why Israel? Why not Yemen or Somalia? Because he hates Jews.
None of this takes away from his talents as a writer and musician, but Roger Waters has clearly and consistently hated Jews for decades. That’s his choice. Calling him out for his hate is our choice. Defending him is your choice. So be it.
1) What do you mean he doesn't support the right of self-determination for Israelis? They have had the right of self-determination ever since they became a legitimate country in 1948; if you're speaking of the inherent right to exist, then that's another whole issue and I'd wager dollars to proverbial doughnuts that Roger Waters fully supports Israel's right to exist as a free and independent state.
2.) If he does indeed put the Star of David onto images of pigs then he deserves to be called out, that is wrong, a no-brainer.
3.) Again, if he does this, he needs to be called out on it, however, I've seen nothing where he states that "worldwide Jewry" is responsible for Israel. That being said, it's again a no-brainer that most of the world's Jews do indeed support the Israeli state, but I have certainly seen many Jews who aren't Zionists, are you sure he's not using the word "Zionist" and not worldwide Jewry? In one respect he is correct though, I'd say more than 90% of the world's Jews do, in fact, support Israeli policy.
I've not seen him focus exclusively on the criticism of Israel, I've seen and heard him speak out on a variety of issues, in fact, I'd say most of what he does speak out on is NOT about Israel. The one I most remember is him speaking for the organization that supports freedom and exoneration for Julian Assange, and on that he does speak out quite stridently. If he is using anti-Semitic language or engages in unfair treatment of Israel or Jews, he deserves to be taken to task each and every time he does it; again though, iff he does it unfairly.
It does raise the interesting meta question of art vs artist. I think I’ve been the most consistent in both pitching and voting for the “bad guys” like MJ and Bobby Brown, so clearly I can separate the art for the artist but I don’t like to give them money (see Roger Waters).
But there’s also artists that inexplicably get a pass: no mention of Vince Neil’s manslaughter or Jimmy Page’s 14 year old girlfriend when we talked Crue and Zep.
and John Lennon used to punch his first wife...I think it's either completely separate the art from artist or lay out the exceptions - pedos would be one. Looking forward to the R Kelly induction soon haha
Great post. I've always liked this album but lately I've listened to it in its wider context of the whole Delaney and Bonnie thing. This takes in everything from Harrison's All Things Must Pass to Joe Cocker's Mad Dogs to Bobby Whitlock's solo stuff, Bobby Keys various adventures, the Bramlett's albums, and a number of other records. I'm imagining one of those Pete Frame 'rock family trees' that shows all the connections, beginning with Blind Faith maybe. Kenneth Womack's latest book, All Things Must Pass Away got me listening to all of this stuff again recently. The album has to stand on its own merits but sometimes I find that I can hear a record more clearly if I see the bigger picture. As for EC, my take has always been that he is a talented guy who needs someone with better judgement and taste to point the way. He is at his best when he is surrounded by other big talents - Mayall, Jack Bruce, Winwood, Delaney Bramlett, Jim Gordon etc. As a guitar player, I've never been able to grasp the magic though I can recognise the skill. He might be God but he's no Rory Gallagher.
Excellent point on Clapton being better with bigger talent than he is alone. And maybe that's why I have so much trouble feeling his music. I'm not a guitarist, but I connect much more emotionally with Iommi and Ronson on the rock side and Muddy Waters and Buddy Guy on the blues side.
I'll keep my comments short after wading deeper into Roger Waters than intended...
Eric was always my A#1 rocker for decades. I struggle with his racist comments, and more recently covid skepticism. I also read his autobiography and saw his showtime biofilm, and Oh.My.God what a f-ed up life. He was born of his father's rape of his sister, was rejected a 2nd time by his birth-mother/sister as an adolescent, seemingly never recovered from falling in love with his best friend's girlfriend, lost a couple decades to drug abuse, and a toddler to a fall from a NYC window. Woof.
That a lifetime of such personal pain produces this musical masterpiece that connects so deeply with so many of us is one of life's great mysteries.
Have you lost your frkn mind, where the hell did you get that gibberish about Clapton's life? He was the son of a British woman who became involved with a Canadian sailor, who then abandoned both of them before Clapton was born! He never knew his father but knew who he was, he was raised by his grandparents who told him his mother was his sister & whom he only saw sporadically growing up.
Jesus Christ, you need to get your bio info from a reputable source!
Who the f taught these three illiterates how to judge quality rock classics? This album is rated by fans of that era, as one of the, if not THE greatest album of that decade, & that's saying a lot compared to the unbelievable albums of the 70's. We now know why rock & roll, for all practical purposes, died in 1980. ALL of these bozos focus on meaningless (to the music) background chatter on the lives of the performers; yes Clapton said some sh*t he shouldn't have, but how many artists across the board have not done the same in a drunken, drugged-out rant, or killed their mother for that matter, lol? The only comment coming from any of this trio of irreverent iconoclasts is what the final one wrote in that Bobby Whitlock has never gotten the credit due him for his writing & phenomenal vocals w/o which LAOALS would never have had the impact it did.
I've always been a little salty about Clapton covering--and getting much more recognition for--JJ Cale's songs.
I think you can absolutely separate the artist from the art. Each person has their own line on that, and their line is 100% valid.
I got about 4 songs in before I realized that I'd never listened to this from start to finish. It's a great record, and it's spot in the Hall is well warranted.
"It's In The way That You Use It" is Clapton's best song. Hands down. Its fantastic.
Somehow your snobbery got through my spam blocker today. I was about to delete it when I noticed the the album being pitched. Since this is one of the most classic albums I read on. For the record, Clapton apologized profusely for his drug-laden racists attacks back in 2018 and is hardly canceled. (What an absurd comment.) Gordon did kill his mother, but was found to be mentally disabled and is spending prison time in a Medical prison in CA. I guess you elitist bastards never made a mistake in your lives. I have no idea where you got the information on the late-great Skydog's guitar being over-dubbed. You guys remind me of 3 east-coast snobs sitting around your flat drinking red wine spouting useless drivel trying to one-up each other. By the way, how are your Biden votes working out for you?
Hi Alan! I hope you're having a great summer. To address your points in order:
1) Drugs and alcohol don't make you racist, but they might make you forget to hide your racism in a crowd;
2) Mental illness doesn't excuse murder, but it should prevent people from getting a gun;
3) I thought I made a mistake once but I was wrong;
4) It is well known that Layla is full of overdubs and it is not a criticism of Allman's playing at all. I just prefer a live, full band jam over studio construction when possible. Europe 72 suffers from the same issue;
5) The only red wine I drink is Manischewitz. Miller Lite all the way baby!
6) Obviously Brandon is a senile old man who can barely put together a sentence. Do you really think I would support some corporate centrist? This is Elizabeth Warren country up here, baby! But even a senile centrist is still better than a conman trying to bullshit his way into a coup.
We're so glad you're back and that you love Layla too. It's one of my top 10 albums. What are your favorite tracks?
And again your effete snobbery comes through. Spiro Agnew got it right when describing some "journalists" as being part of "an effete corps of impudent snobs." Your writing proves him correct, especially when considering our current crop of pseudo-journalists across the board, bought off or intimidated by the deep state (read See-eye-A) who won't question our government or anyone carries the water for them. Journalists nowadays are either too scared or too dumb to confront them on issues like the murders of JFK, RFK, MLK, Jr, JFK, Jr, et al, Apollo hoax, 9/11, endless hegemonic war & last but not least, the persecution of President Trump...nuff said. Oh yes, forgot the biggest one of all, the 70 year coverup of a mountain of information, evidence, files on UFOs, aliens, lies told by NASA, & back ops projects which have sucked up probably $$20 TRILLION tax dollars since 1946 or so.
I’d like to nominate this comment for our non-existent Comment Hall of Fame!
Thank you for reminding me that I need to order a new tin foil hat before the new year!
Ah yes, a classic comeback from one who believes all the narratives dished out by the government who is slowly but surely edging us closer and closer to an Orwellian nightmare, a.k.a., 1984. Just because you can't see what's in front of your proverbial nose doesn't mean you haven't been hoodwinked. Remember what Mark Twain was purported to have said, "it's easier to fool some people than it is to convince them they've been fooled."
Where's the rest of my comment? Is the "expansion" tool only for "bona fide" journalists?
Welcome back, Alan.
Spot-on! Well-written Alan!
so, Michael Jackson's Thriller is out because he was a weirdo and (probable) horrible person; but this overrated, medicore "blues" is in despite Clapton being a documented and horrible person?
Yup, absolutely blame me. I knew this was going to come back on me when I denied Michael Jackson several months back. And here we are. By way of explanation, I'm going to make the following distinction (and you're free to disagree with that as well):
Eric Clapton did and said terrible things, recognized and acknowledged that he did and said those things and made a conscious effort to atone for them. You can say he did so for PR/career-saving purposes and that is certainly a valid argument. But at least he did something.
MJ, on the other hand, did terrible things to vulnerable human beings, refused to admit that he did those things, was enabled to continue doing those things (by people who were arguably just as horrible as he was) and never made any effort to atone for those things. Would he have made amends had he lived longer? Hard to say.
And not that you asked, but I'll continue my distinction with Roger Waters. Roger does not believe he is an anti-semite. He believes he is simply anti-Israel for its policies against the Palestinians. Based on the things he's said and the company he keeps, I don't agree. But I also recognize that there are many people who do.
I don't think you could get even a handful of people to stand up and say there was nothing wrong with what MJ was doing. And by a handful I mean nobody.
I guess that's my line in the sand.
Exactly what is it that Roger Waters has said or what has the "ones with whom he hangs" said that constitutes anti-Semitism? Seems that all one has to do to fall in that category is to criticize Israel.
We’re not here to explain the various manifestations of antisemitism. You seem more than capable enough, and definitely passionate enough to go do some research on your own.
It’s Hanukkah…the three of us have some candles to light and some peace to be enjoyed.
You throw out accusations of anti-Semitism with impunity yet have no desire to quantify/qualify
them.
Roger Waters clearly hates Jews but you have every right to defend and support him. Specifically:
1) he’s a vocal supporter of the BDS movement, which promotes self-determination for Palestinians, but does not accord the same privilege to Israelis.
2) he propagates harmful stereotypes against Jews at his shows by projecting the Star of David on a pig during “Money”, reinforcing the old canard that Jews control the final financial markets.
3) he conflates Israel and worldwide Jewry, and blames all Jews for the policies of the Israeli state.
The world is full of repressive terrorist states, but Roger Waters’ focus is always on Israel - an imperfect country, but a progressive and democratic country. Why Israel? Why not Yemen or Somalia? Because he hates Jews.
None of this takes away from his talents as a writer and musician, but Roger Waters has clearly and consistently hated Jews for decades. That’s his choice. Calling him out for his hate is our choice. Defending him is your choice. So be it.
1) What do you mean he doesn't support the right of self-determination for Israelis? They have had the right of self-determination ever since they became a legitimate country in 1948; if you're speaking of the inherent right to exist, then that's another whole issue and I'd wager dollars to proverbial doughnuts that Roger Waters fully supports Israel's right to exist as a free and independent state.
2.) If he does indeed put the Star of David onto images of pigs then he deserves to be called out, that is wrong, a no-brainer.
3.) Again, if he does this, he needs to be called out on it, however, I've seen nothing where he states that "worldwide Jewry" is responsible for Israel. That being said, it's again a no-brainer that most of the world's Jews do indeed support the Israeli state, but I have certainly seen many Jews who aren't Zionists, are you sure he's not using the word "Zionist" and not worldwide Jewry? In one respect he is correct though, I'd say more than 90% of the world's Jews do, in fact, support Israeli policy.
I've not seen him focus exclusively on the criticism of Israel, I've seen and heard him speak out on a variety of issues, in fact, I'd say most of what he does speak out on is NOT about Israel. The one I most remember is him speaking for the organization that supports freedom and exoneration for Julian Assange, and on that he does speak out quite stridently. If he is using anti-Semitic language or engages in unfair treatment of Israel or Jews, he deserves to be taken to task each and every time he does it; again though, iff he does it unfairly.
It does raise the interesting meta question of art vs artist. I think I’ve been the most consistent in both pitching and voting for the “bad guys” like MJ and Bobby Brown, so clearly I can separate the art for the artist but I don’t like to give them money (see Roger Waters).
But there’s also artists that inexplicably get a pass: no mention of Vince Neil’s manslaughter or Jimmy Page’s 14 year old girlfriend when we talked Crue and Zep.
and John Lennon used to punch his first wife...I think it's either completely separate the art from artist or lay out the exceptions - pedos would be one. Looking forward to the R Kelly induction soon haha
Exactamente!
Blame CJ!
Great post. I've always liked this album but lately I've listened to it in its wider context of the whole Delaney and Bonnie thing. This takes in everything from Harrison's All Things Must Pass to Joe Cocker's Mad Dogs to Bobby Whitlock's solo stuff, Bobby Keys various adventures, the Bramlett's albums, and a number of other records. I'm imagining one of those Pete Frame 'rock family trees' that shows all the connections, beginning with Blind Faith maybe. Kenneth Womack's latest book, All Things Must Pass Away got me listening to all of this stuff again recently. The album has to stand on its own merits but sometimes I find that I can hear a record more clearly if I see the bigger picture. As for EC, my take has always been that he is a talented guy who needs someone with better judgement and taste to point the way. He is at his best when he is surrounded by other big talents - Mayall, Jack Bruce, Winwood, Delaney Bramlett, Jim Gordon etc. As a guitar player, I've never been able to grasp the magic though I can recognise the skill. He might be God but he's no Rory Gallagher.
Excellent point on Clapton being better with bigger talent than he is alone. And maybe that's why I have so much trouble feeling his music. I'm not a guitarist, but I connect much more emotionally with Iommi and Ronson on the rock side and Muddy Waters and Buddy Guy on the blues side.
I'll keep my comments short after wading deeper into Roger Waters than intended...
Eric was always my A#1 rocker for decades. I struggle with his racist comments, and more recently covid skepticism. I also read his autobiography and saw his showtime biofilm, and Oh.My.God what a f-ed up life. He was born of his father's rape of his sister, was rejected a 2nd time by his birth-mother/sister as an adolescent, seemingly never recovered from falling in love with his best friend's girlfriend, lost a couple decades to drug abuse, and a toddler to a fall from a NYC window. Woof.
That a lifetime of such personal pain produces this musical masterpiece that connects so deeply with so many of us is one of life's great mysteries.
Have you lost your frkn mind, where the hell did you get that gibberish about Clapton's life? He was the son of a British woman who became involved with a Canadian sailor, who then abandoned both of them before Clapton was born! He never knew his father but knew who he was, he was raised by his grandparents who told him his mother was his sister & whom he only saw sporadically growing up.
Jesus Christ, you need to get your bio info from a reputable source!
Who the f taught these three illiterates how to judge quality rock classics? This album is rated by fans of that era, as one of the, if not THE greatest album of that decade, & that's saying a lot compared to the unbelievable albums of the 70's. We now know why rock & roll, for all practical purposes, died in 1980. ALL of these bozos focus on meaningless (to the music) background chatter on the lives of the performers; yes Clapton said some sh*t he shouldn't have, but how many artists across the board have not done the same in a drunken, drugged-out rant, or killed their mother for that matter, lol? The only comment coming from any of this trio of irreverent iconoclasts is what the final one wrote in that Bobby Whitlock has never gotten the credit due him for his writing & phenomenal vocals w/o which LAOALS would never have had the impact it did.
Related idea: Review JJ Cale's "Naturally" - it would definitely introduce the album to many people and I think it would be a cool read!
A few random thoughts & a hot take:
I've always been a little salty about Clapton covering--and getting much more recognition for--JJ Cale's songs.
I think you can absolutely separate the artist from the art. Each person has their own line on that, and their line is 100% valid.
I got about 4 songs in before I realized that I'd never listened to this from start to finish. It's a great record, and it's spot in the Hall is well warranted.
"It's In The way That You Use It" is Clapton's best song. Hands down. Its fantastic.
However Clapton ALWAYS gave credit to the ones whose music he covered or imitated, such as Bob Marley & Robert Johnson, along with a host of others.
A significant debut album, in the ranks of Music From The Big Pink and The Doors self titled debut.
Any relation to Cat Stevens?